You need something like $50k with a signup to get access to Vanguards advisory services. He said there must be some kind of other expenses in "asset management sleeves". Are you hiring them for their stockpicking advice, or to manage your portfolio? TBH I'm not sure why they're trying so hard to keep my account. Should I put my IRA accounts with a "financial planner" who works for Morgan Stanley? No one can predict what's going to happen in the future, anyone at Morgan Stanley included. Don't call him again, instead call Vanguard and have them move your IRA over. Besides, you can have the $25 account fee at Vanguard waived if you opt for electronic statement delivery. If the 1% account fee mentioned is related to the mutual fund, then 1% is extremely high. Morgan Stanley is slamming the door on selling Vanguard Group mutual funds, the latest attempt by a big brokerage firm to retaliate against the low-cost fund giant for refusing to pay for … I would've stopped him right there. 67% Upvoted. If I am managing somebody's asset for 1%, I'd do everything not to let s/he leave a well.". I like that they are willing to invest in actual stocks rather than just ETF’s or indexes. Broker Fees Stock/ETF Commission Mutual Fund Commission Options Commission Maintenance Fee Annual IRA Fee; Ally Invest: $0 $9.95 $0.50 per contract $0 $0 TD Ameritrade: $0 $49.99 $0.65 per contract $0 $0 Fidelity: $0 $49.95 $0.65 … So could one approach yield a 10% return over 20-30 years vs a 7% return? Oddly enough, the target date funds usually have higher expense ratios for Vanguard funds, simply because they ARE a fund of funds and they get rebalanced every so often. By analyzing existing cross correlation between Vanguard Total Bond and Morgan Stanley, you can compare the effects of market volatilities on Vanguard Total and Morgan Stanley and check how they will diversify away market risk if combined in the same portfolio for a given time horizon. He said there must be some kind of other expenses in "asset management sleeves". Join our community, read the PF Wiki, and get on top of your finances! Re your edit. Been so long since I've been charged the fee, I've forgotten. Actually, for most accounts the $25 annual fee is waived. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Vanguard operates their funds at cost; their Target Retirement funds do not have their costs partially reimbursed by other more profitable parts of the company. TOP 7 Comments General Mills / Data. Probably unnecessary if you know what asset allocation you want. Vanguard: none. Do note that PAS requires a $50,000 minimum investment. To get that you need Vanguard PAS which adds a 0.3% fee on top of the expense ratio and requires a $50k minimum. However, I've read a lot about how active asset mgmt doesn't always beat out set it and forget it strategies... Vanguard believes in buy and hold. So he's essentially saying that he knows how the market is going to react to rising interest rates? The VFIFX mutual fund itself has no direct expenses, I believe (i.e. Morgan Stanley vs Vanguard vs Personal Capital. This thread is … I also like the financial advisor I met with. Just put 11K into an S&P 500 index. Researchers at Duke recently assessed 21 comparable funds from Vanguard and Fidelity across multiple attributes. Morgan Stanley sent me a check for the tiny balance so I thought I was done with them. u/DaveAlot had it right: Call Vanguard and have them transfer the account. I could invest it on my own which is what I’ve been doing, just want to make the best decision possible. I told him I want to move my account to Vanguard because of the lower costs. wow thanks for the quick response! Not so much with Personal Capital or Vanguard. The site may not work properly if you don't, If you do not update your browser, we suggest you visit, Press J to jump to the feed. Each client should always consult his/her personal tax and/or legal advisor for information concerning his/her individual situation and to learn about any potential tax or other implications that may result from acting on a particular recommendation. Been so long since I've been charged the fee, I've forgotten. I use Fidelity. The one through my company is 0.65 ish. This guy is full of shit and is desperately telling you anything to try to keep fleecing you of your money via the fees you are paying. This is representative of the expense ratio of the basket of mutual funds that this fund holds. Call Vanguard, have them pull the account from Morgan Stanley. I think it's either e-statements or a certain balance in the account. All good responses below, he's trying to screw you. You don't need an advisor. 0 7. facebook twitter reddit hacker news link. I recognize they are salesman and I liked the one from MS because he wasn’t as aggressive as the others. Absolutely. In any case, the 0.16% expense ratio reflects both the cost-conscientiousness of Vanguard's management, in addition to the massive economies of scale that Vanguard can leverage with the amount of assets under management in their Target Retirement funds. And honestly not sure how to best invest these extra funds. ...for a market w/ rising interest rates. Active management also doesn't work and results in far poorer returns than long-term passive investing. And he countered with the following arguments: My account fee right now is only 1%, plus a 75 dollar account fee per year. If you really, really want to talk to a CFP at Vanguard, you could pay 0.30% per year to sign up for their Personal Advisor Services, which is essentially a semi-managed account (which goes to show how overpriced Morgan Stanley's services are at 1.00%). Three fund portfolio is really all you need. Cookies help us deliver our Services. Vanguard's attempt to launch its own S&P-based ETFs was foiled after it lost a licensing battle to S&P in court. Talk all you want. If the market returns 7-10% per year on average, they're essentially taking 10-15% of your gains per year, and that's not even counting fund expenses. They can and do. Every time I have ever had to call vanguard I have always gotten a real person who was helpful. E-statements, 10k minimum per fund, or qualify for Voyager level($50k in VG mutual funds or ETFs). Your salesman is claiming that you don't need bonds because he likely doesn't get commission for selling bonds to you. Fund investors nevertheless can do well at Vanguard, but the broker needs a major software overall to be competitive. You have it right. Learn about budgeting, saving, getting out of debt, credit, investing, and retirement planning. Thanks! This is for two reasons: first, at Vanguard you can get advice but it's an added-cost service, and second, because market-timing is a dumbass idea in the first place. How has your experience been so far? VFIFX has a 0.16% net expense ratio. Morgan Stanley Smith Barney LLC, its affiliates and Morgan Stanley Financial Advisors do not provide legal or tax advice. That's on the very low end for needing bespoke wealth management services. If that makes sense. Vanguard also has no annual fee if you opt for electronic delivery of statements so his statement is plain wrong. Clients can add money to existing Vanguard investments through the first quarter of 2018. He's correct that nobody at Vanguard would tell you that. The vanguard target date fund I'd want to invest in has 10% bond allocation, which he says is way too high... 10% bonds is perfectly reasonable (although so is 0% IMO, especially for someone young). I won't have anyone to talk to at Vanguard, whereas I can call him whenever I want. 2X price target of the current price- per WSJ If you want expert financial advice in the future, you should go to a fee-only CFP. I've spoken with someone at Fidelity maybe once or twice a year on average for the past 10 years and this was just about Fidelity-specific things not about the market at large or investment advice. I have three options: 1) put it in a plan that charges 1% of the total assets every year, or 2) put it in a plan that charges $50 per account annually, or 3) give itstraight to Vanguard and pay around 0.5% per account annually? He said no one at vanguard is going to suggest I move assets around based on what's happening in the market. He won't have anyone to call at Vanguard that will help in an advisory capacity. This isn't high as far as the financial advice industry as a whole goes, but is high compared to other alternatives. I’ve heard Morgan Stanley isn’t good for normies (anyone that’s not insanely wealthy). Morgan Stanley said its goal was to close out under-performing and less popular funds. There's "no way" vanguard can offer a target date retirement fund with a .16% expense ratio and a 25 annual fee. … Blend a few mutual funds or etfs together to get the asset allocation you want. Technically true. Morgan Stanley; Fidelity; VOTE VIEW RESULT. If you opt for maintaining your indexed mutual funds/ETFs, you could cut expenses even further to around 0.05%. You can generally learn what you need to know on this sub for the dollar amounts you have right now. With option #1, I can trade and not be assessed anything … Vanguard makes its money from the holdings within). Having a "guy" to talk to is overrated. This is blatantly bad advice and exposes your advisor for a salesman. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. It is what it is. Many options out there have no per annum account fee. It isn't prudent to have 100% stocks. Morgan Stanley = 1% AUM Vanguard = .3% AUM Personal Capital = .89% AUM. https://finance.yahoo.com/quote/VFIFX/profile?p=VFIFX. I’ve had sessions with all three and so far feel most comfortable with Morgan Stanley. In essence Morgan Stanley charged us a fee on a refunded fee. Do not try to call Morgan Stanley to do the transaction; they'll just lie to you some more (and maybe try to screw you over by sending you a "distribution" (which would incur taxes and penalties) instead of executing a proper "transfer). Continue managing your own money, in the long run it’ll be cheaper and more tax efficient. Charles Schwab and Vanguard are two of the largest investment companies in the world. I felt like I am being treated like I invest in lots of money from Vanguard (I had like $5k in Vanguard). Oh and, I have seen many Mondays where Vanguard announced that their call volume is high, and suggest to call back the next day. Great post! That’s fair feedback. And it's worth pointing out that if they were good at picking and choosing individual stocks, they could make a lot more money doing it of their own accord than by taking a 1% cut from your money. He's a fucking liar trying to screw you, why would you want to call him?! There aren't hidden fees. If you’re looking for a platform for investing, you may consider two of the largest brokerage firms, Vanguard and Fidelity. Merrill Lynch vs Vanguard Results Vanguard’s funds aren’t enough to give the broker an edge over powerhouse Merrill. By using our Services or clicking I agree, you agree to our use of cookies. You can also utilize pair trading strategies of matching a long position in Vanguard Total with a … Cookies help us deliver our Services. So I have about 11k in a rothIRA. They then told me that I need to call Morgan Stanley to liquidate my assets since theyre in funds vanguard doesn't offer. It's important to be clear eyed about this. If you really, really want to talk to a CFP at Vanguard, you could pay 0.30% per year to sign up for their Personal Advisor Services, which is essentially a semi-managed account (which goes to show how overpriced Morgan Stanley's services are at 1.00%). He said no one at vanguard is going to suggest I move assets around based on what's happening in the market. 0.3% are still way cheaper than 1%. Investing. The only edit I'll offer is some fee-only advisors don't have minimums, but for the most part your right! comments. Your MS guy believes in getting his commission. Ally Invest: Up to $3,500 cash bonus + $0 commission trades. Gotta choose between Morgan Stanley vs Fidelity for my corp stock plan. And active asset mgmt typically doesn't beat the market.....and HE is probably not one of the ones that does, New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, More posts from the personalfinance community. For what it's worth, a financial advisor would dedicate about the same amount of time to an individual account with your balance as you would. Reading the title got me thinking "of course they are doing their damnedest not to let you leave. Both two times when I called Vanguard and Vanguard called me (related to one of the question I submitted online), they are both professional and full of courtesy. There's "no way" vanguard can offer a target date retirement fund with a .16% expense ratio and a 25 annual fee. I’ve had sessions with all three and so far feel most comfortable with Morgan Stanley. "Only" 1%? I won't have anyone to talk to at Vanguard, whereas I can call him whenever I want. Target date retirement funds from Vanguard and Fidelity are around 0.15-0.2%. Vanguard is "only" .05-.2 and NO fee per year, Then don't use a target date fund. By comparing employers on employee ratings, salaries, reviews, pros/cons, job openings and more, you'll feel one step ahead of the rest. Overview of JP Morgan Chase and Fidelity Fidelity and JP Morgan Chase’s new discount broker You Invest Trade both offer trading in securities through online … However, you can only invest in Vanguard funds (as Vanguard doesn't offer anyone else's funds on its platform). The vanguard target date fund I'd want to invest in has 10% bond allocation, which he says is way too high for a market w/ rising interest rates. So what do you guys think... should I move accounts? Thus spurned, Vanguard cut a deal with Morgan Stanley. Those are extremely different skillsets. calling them now. So I would not call that you have nobody to talk to. Don't talk to this guy again; he'll figure it out once he gets the transfer request from Vanguard. What's the move here. I have between 100-150k of investable assets. Still, I thought it was prudent to move it into a lower cost account. share. If you really need somebody to talk to, save up to 25k and sign up for Vanguard Personal Advisors Service. Morgan Stanley is a shitty company and your advisor is harvesting you for commissions with bad advice. Any recommendations? Some companies do actually do subsidize their index funds with profits from other parts of the company, but it's far less insidious than how your advisor makes it out to be. More posts from the personalfinance community. So the question is, if someone paid you $1000-$1500 per year to manage your own finances (checking performance monthly, rebalancing quarterly/biannually, re-evaluating your plan annually), would you do it? report. Looks like you're using new Reddit on an old browser. It might be the best version because of Morgan Stanley’s new Platinum CashPlus bank account, which offers a $550 Annual Engagement Bonus to cover the entire annual fee on the American Express Morgan Stanley Platinum card.. Does anyone have experience with any of the three I mentioned? I’m currently evaluating if it’s worth working with one of the top wealth managers in CA (Andy Chase) or go with Vanguard/Personal Capital for retirement/all around wealth and financial management. When I called they gave me the same story. Sorry if the answers to my questions are really obvious. Where do people find these low ER target date funds? More so would hire them to manage my portfolio. I don't mean to come off as super anti-advisor in general. To be slightly fair, the type of service offered is different. You won't have an individual to give you financial advice if you move to Vanguard, but you can still call them. LOG IN or SIGN UP. By analyzing existing cross correlation between Morgan Stanley and Vanguard 500 Index, you can compare the effects of market volatilities on Morgan Stanley and Vanguard 500 and check how they will diversify away market risk if combined in the same portfolio for a given time horizon. Vanguard vs Fidelity. If you want to be really lazy, just put it all in the appropriate target date fund. That is highway robbery. The vanguard target date fund I'd want to invest in has 10% bond allocation, which he says is way too high for a market w/ rising interest rates. Morgan Stanley is slamming the door on selling Vanguard Group mutual funds, the latest attempt by a big brokerage firm to retaliate against the low-cost fund giant for refusing to pay for access to its salesforce. What can I say, he's a salesman. Still way more reasonable than MS's rate. I forget the forms off hand but I did it the other year. Fidelity vs Morgan Stanley vs Vanguard, Charles Schwab and TD Ameritrade (2021) Morgan Stanley vs Fidelity (and Others): Fees. Not a huge chunk of change. If you never plan to hold more than £80,000 in Vanguard funds then investing via Vanguard's own platform (i.e Vanguard Investor) would be cheaper, assuming you invest via an ISA or general investment account. Morgan Stanley, the largest U.S. brokerage by salesforce, said on Wednesday it is dropping mutual funds from Vanguard Group, the largest U.S. mutual fund firm. Right. Actually, for most accounts the $25 annual fee is waived. So I called my advisor at MorganStanley, who happens to be a family friend. JP Morgan Chase You Invest vs Fidelity 2021 Fidelity versus JP Morgan Chase You Invest Trade - which company is better? I like that they are willing to invest in actual stocks rather than just ETF’s or indexes. I’ve been using a combination of M1 Finance, Robinhood, and Fidelity to manage my current investments. You don't get access to CFPs at Vanguard until you have $500k+ with them. EDIT: I've opened up a vanguard account and asked them to initiate a transfer. Please. The article goes on to say that Morgan Stanley requires other mutual fund companies to pay $250,000 to $850,000 annually for “shelf space.” This pay-to-play model of … LendingClub and Morgan Stanley's respective deals to buy Radius Bank and E-Trade shows the embrace of digital financial services, and the build vs. buy debate. ASTRA ZENECA as a partner andTOP shareholders such as : FIDELITY, VANGUARD, GOLDMAN SACHS,VANGUARD, MORGAN STANLEY, BLACKROCK, WELLINGTON. You feel comfortable because they're salesmen who's job it is to make you feel comfortable. I have been doing my own investment management for about 1.5 years but would really prefer working with a professional that can be dedicated to this full time. Retirement. Do note that PAS requires a $50,000 minimum investment. Morgan Stanley vs Fidelity IRA accounts. There's no annual fee at all if you select electronic delivery of statements. Vanguard’s expansion into financial advice “is a material development, no doubt about it,” says Lisa Shalett, chief investment officer for Morgan Stanley Wealth Management. Get thee to Vanguard, you don't even need to go through MS, just open the Vanguard account and have them move it. Appreciate it. There is no way in hell you need to be paying someone to manage $11k. Unless you have $100k+, you'd need to find someone that charges hourly. As long as you invest it back into another Roth within 60 days, aren't the taxes and penalties voided? Want to comment? There’s a wealth of information on the bogleheads forum. Then I received a bill from my former employer for the yearly "administrative fee" that they were charged by Morgan Stanley that nearly equaled the amount of the "rebated fee". There's only 11k in it! This salesman is selling and probably believes what he is saying because his trainer sold him and he doesn't have the education to know its not true!